Speaker 1 (00:00.724)
Awesome! Look at us live!

episode and I’m a very special guest which I’d to introduce yourself.

Hi, I’m Saane, Sanna Van Rossen.

And three questions, who are you, which you kind of just described because of your name, what do you do and why do you do what you do? Three big questions, I’m just getting caught up.

Don’t be so I lost my name.

Speaker 1 (00:27.288)
Well I guess I said who are you so anything else that comes to you?

Yes, of course my identity. So who am I? So it’s a very big question. Who am I? I think in my life, I think I went on a journey that I’m still searching for who am I?

Yeah, question.

Speaker 1 (00:57.23)
If you agree, yeah.

So I think it’s the being stage, know, the being and where you can choose who you are. I think that will be my journey now.

And that’s freedom right to choose who you want to be.

It’s like autonomy or autonomy about your life. Yeah, so what I’m doing, I was a physiotherapist and I had my own company in the physiotherapy. But I really don’t like all the rules and all the insurance rules. I was helping people with very beautiful work, people with a lot of pain.

Yeah. So what do you do?

Speaker 1 (01:46.312)
in physical and emotional

Well, they came with physical pain, but I went with these people to the cause from the pain and I was thinking, the cause is like very deep, a couple of layers deeper. And I was thinking, wow, and then I was touching those layers. There were beautiful things happening. I think, okay, we need to…

bigger.

I need to bring this bigger and then I stopped with physiotherapy and started wood coaching.

love the name root coaching and so that was born roughly how long ago? I now in 2025 almost 2026.

Speaker 2 (02:34.094)
So I started with this year in May. Wow! I just went the other way around. make the switch.

Yeah, and why do you why are you kind of I know you’re on the path or on the path? But why have you decided to go deep?

Yeah, so the things I’ve been through were also very deep and I went through all those layers in myself and there are lot more layers I think and then I was thinking wow the quality I have I can see now.

I can see now what I can give myself and other people. So I need this freedom to go through this with people.

For me it was about freedom too. Everyone has their reasons for healing. Sometimes it’s because they just can’t do what they’re doing anymore. Which was partially my story but also I just wanted that sense of freedom within my mind, within myself. And so what’s your story? You can make it as long or as short as you like but I do want to go deep into what you do, how you do it, using the psychedelics and all that juicy stuff.

Speaker 1 (03:47.95)
I would have to talk about that, but it’s legal in Holland by the way, so we’re going to go into that. Yeah, what’s your story like from, if you don’t mind sharing it because I know we’ve spoken, we’ve been out for a nice high tea before this episode. Yeah, so share with us, like what have you been through?

When you don’t understand my English you can tell me, right? I’m trying to do my best in this very deep subject to find the good words for it. I was adopted from Sri Lanka. I think from the beginning you don’t have to reflect on your mother, right? Because I grew up in a very white

Yeah

Speaker 2 (04:35.712)
environment so yeah who was I

Yeah, because you know you looked with your adopted parents wife. So you looked different.

Yes, the smell was different and the of the baby. And everything was different. When you are a baby you don’t have the consciousness, but the whole system knows. And when I went to live on myself,

Three.

Speaker 1 (05:01.986)
The nervous system doesn’t forget.

Speaker 2 (05:09.986)
Then I was thinking, I really need to know where I come from. Who was the lady who gave me life? Yeah. So what happened? So first I went to my country to explore. Right. And when I was there, was like, whoa, holy shit.

in your birth country did you feel? Yes, really.

Immediately, the smell, the people, I think it’s energy, the energy of the roots where you come from. And apparently I was open for this, then you can also feel this.

You have to be open otherwise you’re physically there.

It’s attractive or reflective. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (06:04.02)
So when I got home it did have a very big impact.

So the first time you went you didn’t meet your… No. You just went to explore where you were from and the field.

But I knew when I was there, I need to find my mother. But it had so impact on me that I was avoiding in the Netherlands, avoiding the feelings, everything. And then I was thinking, okay, I really need to do this now.

Yeah.

Speaker 1 (06:41.838)
Do you mind sharing what you were doing to numb and avoid because… relate to, you know, restriction or something else. What did you do to avoid it happening?

I was very in drugs, lot of drugs, everything I have tried out sexually. A lot of escaping. Because I didn’t want to feel, because it was so overwhelming, everything.

can escape as well.

Speaker 1 (07:13.154)
My listens will resonate with that. Do you mind sharing what you shared with me when we were eating about how you were conceived? Because I think that’s worth talking about because of how deep this goes.

Yeah, this goes very deep because my mother was raped and she kept me from this rape and there was a lot of violence. So she was fleeing for this guy, this man or my father. So there was lot of violence.

And that’s in, and you and I both believe, and we’ll go into it I’m sure when you share how you help people, all of this imprint that was created at your birth before you were born as a physical human that hasn’t had and still will have an energetic impact on you with the energy that conceived you, the violence, the non-consent, like knowing your story and how deep you’ve gone, how would you say that’s affected

your life so far, like how you conceived going that far back.

everything it is like the start is there yeah it starts there really 100 % 100 % and my life is like yeah of course did you know the teams for me

Speaker 1 (08:34.926)
The themes, patterns that we’re kind of sharing. What kind of patterns?

sexually this also very not protected there I might I think myself it was like that very low very low yeah so yeah I put myself there without any self-love or something so you you know there are a lot of things happened yeah which was very painful yeah

And how did you then go from being in Sri Lanka, feeling this overwhelming sense of all this emotions wanting to erupt and explode and you were like, no, I can’t handle that so I’m gonna numb. I guess there came a point where you naturally got to where you were like, I’m not, like what did you think consciously? I’m not gonna numb anymore? What happened that enabled you to be like, I’m ready to heal this? Like, what happened?

Yes, very good question. think when I came on the physiotherapy there was a little bit already about the mental health and the stress, etc. the nervous system and then slowly I be aware, you know, I went aware of this and I had also always an attraction.

Yeah

Speaker 1 (09:59.63)
I’m just gonna, I think it’s still on the record but I don’t you to stick so I’m just gonna do that.

And I was a very sensitive girl. The things I had always attraction to spiritual stuff. know, spiritual stuff. I really want to learn over this, over this, over this, you know. That was my character a little bit. And so I slowly came into the healing parts of…

So

Speaker 1 (10:25.87)
Yeah. What feeling or what emotion, because this is just my take on this and I’m curious what your take on this is. I think or believe or it just makes sense to me that we have an emotion which is an energy, a vibration of energy, and then if we choose to we feel it. So the feeling is almost like a doing, like an allowing of the emotion. Whereas if we choose not to feel it, we suppress it. So what emotion…

Did you first experience that you then allowed yourself to feel?

Yeah, I think the sadness. Yeah, sadness. I think I’ve been always sad in the in undercurrent.

All the sadness I was with me. So I think that was the first emotion I really allowed. And it was like after the ayahuasca ceremony.

about that so was this before I think it was after you met your biological yeah in Sri Lanka

Speaker 2 (11:28.596)
Yes, awesome.

Yes, in 2010 I flew for the first time to my home country Sri Lanka and the year after when my mother was found I flew to Sri Lanka to meet her. It was the next roller coaster. I can’t imagine how it would be now.

Speaker 1 (11:56.414)
I think in the first… So for 11 hours, what Yeah.

You know?

Speaker 2 (12:01.806)
And my adoption father was with me

me. Did it feel supportive?

Yeah, it was because he was getting us to be with our baby. And now he went with me to meet her again. it was very special. that’s the words. Yeah, but I was nervous, everything. Now, yeah.

Yeah

Speaker 1 (12:20.206)
That’s fair.

Speaker 1 (12:28.748)
I can’t even imagine how you would to do that for that time. And so how did you, well first of share with the listeners that don’t know what, I can never pronounce this word, ayahuasca. Ayahuasca. What is it? How did you come about it? And then if you share that experience.

Yeah, it is a plant medicine and now it’s illegal in Holland but before it was legal. of dramatic things happened and then it became illegal. But the plant medicine, how can I explain?

Is it a herb? Is it a leaf? it… Is it like a bark of a tree? what is it? Is it a a tree? Is Is a a Is

Like, it’s called scabby?

Speaker 2 (13:13.27)
You drink it. And it is like… It has like a spirit and it’s calling you. It’s calling you. It’s time to do this. I went with an old friend of mine. I went to do this. And we drink the… How do you say it? The drink.

And we were waiting there on our bed.

So you went to like, was it just with your friend? It was like a proper… Right, it wasn’t just randomly you got some with a friend and it was like a whole thing.

The whole ceremony, it was safe. woman who gave this felt fairly safe and still. So we drink that and what’s happening is like your awareness is going like doing this expansion, you know. But it was so heavy because all the pain is coming up before you.

Before you can feel free, right?

Speaker 2 (14:30.854)
The mirror is very hard. They call it also the mother ayahuasca, mother energy from the feminine energy. It’s very different from the father energy. The father energy is soft and the ayahuasca is very hard. So the mirror is like no avoiding. You need to puke.

Yeah

Speaker 1 (14:51.022)
There’s no avoiding it.

Speaker 1 (14:56.137)
To bridge and release.

But it was so beautiful, I can’t really explain it. In my book I have the whole explanation what I’ve been through.

Yeah, and your book is, you’ve got two books. Yes. I know they’re both in Dutch, I assume.

And the first one is an e-book also in English.

and what’s that called? Adoption Cover-Up. Adoption Cover-Up. Wow. And then can buy it, and also buy books. also, okay, so if you want to know her full experience of that, her books.

Speaker 2 (15:28.814)
Yeah, but the second book is standing in the second book. Oh, in the second book. Yeah, maybe we will translate it.

In English? in English. So why do you think the experience you had that is hard to put into words, and I get that, it’s more of like an experience, but why do you think it was necessary or you felt called to have plant medicine to help you, other than go down the traditional therapy route, you know, even like meditation, visualisation, which I know that you still value, but what do you think…

led you to using plant medicine to support you to open up more or like what does it how does it help us

That’s a beautiful question because I never had a before period where everything was fine. The start is like in Sri Lanka. It was really a drop, right? It was not a normal… The kid is like…

Made completely from love and consent

Speaker 2 (16:29.326)
Yeah, it’s So I think the communication system and also the mental system is so really strong. and bizarre. The ego. It’s so big, people can’t go through this. Not like a psychologist.

Yeah, I’m protecting.

Speaker 1 (16:53.352)
Psychologists, because I mean it’s worth adding my two cents here when I’ve experienced plant medicine once with what I shared with you when we were eating and when I’ve shared with my listeners before. For me it helped because it got my ego out of the way. Like you said it like kind of opens yourself up to what I got from that experience.

Open to all.

Speaker 1 (17:16.808)
I knew I couldn’t have got consciously because my ego would have completely denied and avoided and just deflected any truth that would have come. the mushrooms for me just helps, like you say, it’s just this, this, whatever that word is, expansion to then get to the deeper stuff without the ego being the defensive controller in the way.

And that’s the thing because the ego is lying continuously and very sharp lying to you.

So you believe it most of the time. That’s all you’ve ever known. Yeah. So you had this experience with it. my god.

It’s not for everyone. Really.

You to feel, because I’ve heard about it in my healing journey and I’ve had a little bit of interest but I’ve never felt the call to do it. So I just listen to one day I might and then therefore I will. So I think it’s saying that you will just know, you’ll just have a feeling, right?

Speaker 2 (18:13.134)
Yes, you know. When it’s time, you know. And you need to be healthy. That’s very important.

Yes, that’s where things people with eating disorders in recovery, they’re not at full health. They’re not they’re malnourished

It’s a contraindication. And that was my start of my healing journey. And then my normal therapy.

to be helpful.

Speaker 1 (18:36.814)
Unlocked and uncovered and got to, would you say you got to the root straight away in that experience?

I went back to Sri Lanka and I was in the lovations. It was very clear. And I was that baby. The baby was full of panicking. I felt everything from there. After this, in the integration weeks, softened. It was a little bit softener. So I was ready now for…

Thank

Speaker 1 (18:56.302)
You know what?

Speaker 2 (19:11.854)
The inner child training. After that I did the inner child training.

And let’s dive into that because my niece says no I’m all about inner child. It just was a natural follow-on I guess from the experience you had and your two books and the first one was about what exactly the second one you described your experience during a plant medicine journey what was the first book about one they can get in English?

Yeah, you know this! That’s great!

Speaker 2 (19:39.022)
The first book is, I did a lot of research. So I went back and forth in Holland and in Sri Lanka to do the research what happens there. So I also spoke to a lot of mothers there. And there was also a lot of mothers with their children were stolen. This is book like…

I’m not trusting you. know, the truth is coming. The truth is coming up. yeah, so this is first book.

So is it about adoption? it? So it’s about all that adoption and what happens?

Yes, adoption system, what happens and what is the truth.

Wow and the second one’s more about your healing during the day. Wow, yeah. There’s a difference. Very powerful. And so how does inner child work come for you and then how do you now help people with the inner child work? Because I know that you use plant medicine as well which I’m really excited to hear because

Speaker 2 (20:25.55)
The truth in my

Satisfied?

Speaker 1 (20:44.94)
I mean it was life changing for me, it was just one day for me. With a proper experienced person it’s not like I say it’s not just randomly, let’s do that nice and then just have the intention by yourself. I’m not saying that can’t be beneficial but do you agree that needs to be in like a whole ceremony intentional safe setting for you to get the full experience?

Of course, yes. the health medicine, the safe setting is everything.

Yeah, yes. So when you first heard about Inner Child’s work, what did you think? How did you experience it?

The inner child work, I’ve heard from it because there was a company I’m really interested in and they did this inner child work one weekend it was. So I was at the right place, the life is already like, you know? Exactly.

and

Speaker 1 (21:39.31)
already chosen in a way by your spiritual path.

Yeah, sometimes I don’t think I choose.

Well your soul chose, I think. Like your soul chose where your human journey could make choices and what way…

The Austrian… Yeah, I can imagine what you’re

Yeah, so she was there as in you, she like, you observed yourself, was like, oh, I just happened to be in this place where there’s an inner child experience, and you went.

Speaker 2 (22:05.998)
So I went and it was such a deep training for me as well because the physical training, I needed that, the physical training. And yeah, I felt everything, all the exercises, the anger work, everything was in this training. And after this, I was thinking, yeah, this is it. We need to start from the basic.

Like, babyhood. Right before that, everyone. I agree. And when you said you felt a lot, again, I’m hammering home the emotions because a lot of my listeners are so afraid to Yes. The eating disorder is a great coping mechanism, a great numbing tool, a great control mechanism to feel safe, to stop feeling. I know it’s hard to describe, it’s more of an experience, but how did you feel safe?

Feel?

Speaker 1 (22:56.416)
Or didn’t you feel safe when you first started allowing these big emotions to be in your body?

Yeah, it’s also a very good question. I did a this week about safety because you know the environment can be safe. The bedding.

your physical

You know what I mean? Like for example now we’re physically safe.

Exactly, but the triggers you feel sometimes the trainer is like picking, my body doesn’t feel safe. But the thing is, she was there for me, while I didn’t feel safe. that’s the healing thing I think.

Speaker 1 (23:29.036)
You know?

Speaker 1 (23:40.428)
So you need that safe person physically present with you.

Yeah, that was the eating part. Yeah, because I don’t think that the trauma was maybe the adoption, but there was no one for me. Yeah, that was the trauma. Yeah.

alone. And I also believe that trauma is created via relationship beings as humans, right? So I think trauma is created in relationships by our attachment styles. it can only therefore then be healed in relationship. Yes.

I totally agree, because we need to be triggered, we need to have our blind spots.

Yeah. Mirror a hell job and someone to hold you through something. Yes. So we’re not supposed to do this alone. No.

Speaker 2 (24:29.582)
Pain is like delight.

This is a bit of a side note but it’s just come to me. I had someone reach out to ask to be a guest on my podcast recently and I kind of felt into it and I was like, no, I’m not saying that what these people are doing are wrong but there’s something now, I if you’ve heard of it, it’s called rapid resolution therapy and apparently in a 90 minute session you can heal everything that you’ve ever been through without feeling anything.

They just give you stories and metaphors. I’m not saying it doesn’t help at all. I know I sound like I’m taking the piss a little bit, but my immediate response was you have to feel it to heal it. You can’t just bypass all that pain because that’s what creates the light. So I’m assuming you agree.

Yeah, it’s very interesting because yes, I think still we need to feel everything But there are also people saying you need to shift yourself on this different timeline. So this new exploration I’m doing from Okay, is this true? So I’m very curious about about this Do we heal our do we need to heal our trauma or is it like the shift?

Maybe it’s both. Yeah

Speaker 1 (25:54.616)
Thanks.

I think you can do a lot of healing if you have like, right, this is what I’m experiencing. I think you need to acknowledge where you’re at first, no matter whether you go to the past or not. You need to acknowledge what’s happening in your life and then move forward. But I, from my personal experience, was so, everything clicked when I understood why I was the way I was. mean, not everyone knows and they can’t understand everything, but to help me see from going…

saying that I had a perfect childhood to being like, shit, my god, like I had like a very traumatic childhood, like when I was locked outside when I cried, I thought that was funny because my family thought it was funny. That was like child abuse, that’s not okay. So it was helpful for me, it gave me extra compassion for myself. So I think for me, I needed to feel everything my inner child, my little girl didn’t feel safe to feel.

Because it’s stored in your physical body though. That emotion’s stored until it’s released. So I think you have to feel it actually.

For me it helps as well and even it’s the truth you can shift on me and I’ve a lot of work and training. Then still I have a beautiful training. The inner child is beautiful to do.

Speaker 1 (27:16.622)
And I think, are you in agreement that, let’s say when you were two, you had all these feelings of fear that you weren’t held in, that you weren’t responded to, so you didn’t know how to feel and express that in a safe way, so it’s held in your physical body somewhere, until that is felt today, it’s forever gonna be there. So whether we, we don’t have to know where it’s come from, but we have to allow all this to just be felt.

I think this is the

Speaker 2 (27:44.366)
I think everything is needed, also the knowledge about our system, how works, brain, everything. Then the self-leadership, how is your ego reacting and the parents, and then you have to feel it to reprogram.

And then take that action, because that’s the hard part isn’t it? To feel the fear, to be there for little you and then to take the action anyway to show yourself it’s safe to do something different now. So in this inner child experience that you had, what’s one exercise that you can share with us that you’ve back then found like really triggering or challenging?

Exactly.

Speaker 2 (28:30.702)
Yeah, yes, I can remember and I also do it in my own training as well. There was an exercise you You needed to write down all the excuses you want from all the people in your life So from your mother, from your father, from everyone

So excuses that you have for them or excuses that they give to you.

So you need to write it down, like mother, it would be nice to have those excuses and then you write it down.

Give me an example.

Speaker 2 (29:08.693)
Like… SweetSana, that’s my name, SweetSana, sorry that I didn’t see you. Apologies. Apologies, yeah, excuse me.

excuse is a posh word, so I’m thinking excuse to me means you’re bypassing your responsibility so if I was late I’d be like I’m sorry I’m late but…

That’s why I have do this. That wasn’t the exercise.

Step one is for you to write to yourself as if your mother was saying I am sorry for

Yeah, okay, and then we needed to sit in a very close together and then someone needs to read those apologizes. Oh yeah, and the first time I was thinking that’s really… I was not going to work, but the person, like you need to…

Speaker 1 (29:57.252)
wow.

Speaker 1 (30:01.654)
Yeah

Speaker 1 (30:09.674)
read it to you. right at you.

Yes, right at me from the heart, know, a state of self-awareness.

Yeah, like around the safe and present. Yeah. I literally get cold sugars. I can feel the intensity.

That was crazy. my, it was so… Wow, and everyone was like… And I still see it in my training as well. It’s very powerful.

dear.

Speaker 1 (30:37.198)
I can imagine that’s very powerful.

Speaker 1 (30:44.786)
Wow. And one that I did with, I did one retreat one time and it was a, I loved it and I will do more in the future at some point, not soon because of my young daughter, but we did an exercise where we like, there’s complete strangers to each other and they have to look into each other’s eyes for two minutes. yeah. And then you swapped around the room and like I’m looking more intensely to you now, you can tell, you can look at someone’s story and pain through the eyes and…

I’m

They were just sobbing and then I was watching and I was sobbing like with a timer like oh my god I’m it seems like five years. That was a non-spoken exercise that was just present and without even knowing what happened healing just took place. And you can’t explain it.

Yeah, exactly.

Speaker 2 (31:32.483)
You can’t experiment. You need to feel it. need to experience. And that’s why I’m thinking physical training is so important.

When you say physical training, what do you mean by that? Even now I’m so loving having a guest like…

Like not online. Not coaching. like music editing.

Speaker 2 (31:54.21)
Yeah, we can see and can feel which one is…

So after that experience you then, because you’ve started your business in May but you’ve already written two books way before then, way before you started but you’ve done a lot of healing work way before you started your business obviously.

For inner child training yes.

Speaker 2 (32:16.59)
Yeah a lot of, yeah. My second book was coming out last year in December, almost a year ago. And I did make an authentic movement show for this book.

amazing. you reach out to TV or did they reach out to you?

For my first book was the TV media, Attention. They reached me with

Yeah

And they made like a documentary or something of that book. Can you still access that? To what?

Speaker 2 (32:50.862)
Yes you can on YouTube. I think it’s Dutch.

Go ahead and dutch,

think it’s the adoption part 1. Or Sanne van Rosse, because then you’ll it too.

There’s that.

then I’ll find you with that. And then you’ve also got, because this woman does not brag enough, she turns up today, she’s like, I’ve got these affirmation cards that I’ve just made and designed, like for children, for emotions and needs. That’s huge. And do you do any other affirmation cards?

Speaker 2 (33:28.002)
No, I only did the emotion card and the needs, right? Yeah, what we need in this emotion.

Yeah, that’s so powerful and that’s awesome. What she has available, we are in Dutch for now.

Well, yeah, they are now Dutch and I’m hoping for a Sinhala so I can use them for Sri Lanka.

of course. Because, what language is your language? that’s the language. I’ve never heard of that. Can you speak it? I what air though is.

No.

Speaker 2 (33:59.63)
Is it Ayuba Wal?

no! Maybe, and maybe you might find it easy if your roots just kind of… Yeah, in your nose.

don’t know if it’s written on my part.

Exactly, exactly that. So you had this experience and then obviously fast forward now to your business, how you help people is called Root Coaching which I love the name so much. How do you help people and what kind of people do you help? Do you get all sorts of people with problems coming to you?

Yeah, so the change to physical therapist to this was a big change, right? The clients will be very different, yeah. Because they need to pay by themselves or through the company they work. But I give training, like the free your inner child.

Speaker 1 (34:39.502)
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (34:50.253)
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (34:55.671)
Today evening is like for six days and we spread it out in like three months or four months. So the integration is very…

What needs to be, doesn’t need to be combed.

Really? No, exactly. yeah, like in short, the weekend one, two days and there is a lot of space for your story. And then you go dive in your story. What have you been through? The apology exercise and all that stuff. And weekend two is authentic movement.

moving it out through and out the body.

Yes, the emotions exactly, angler words we will do.

Speaker 1 (35:36.366)
Let’s just pause there and talk about anger. Let me time check. Time check. my god. We’ve got about 20 minutes. Okay. Because a lot of my clients and my past self was like, don’t resonate with anger. But actually, underneath the denial and the sadness and the heartbreak and there was so much rage.

This hot fiery rage that I understand was coming up because I knew that I deserved better after I felt the hot, I needed to feel the lay of the heart right first and the grieving of like the childhood I thought I had and I didn’t and all the things that I wish I’d had and hadn’t and after that was like this rage of like now it’s safe to be angry at what I didn’t have not in a victim way but

just that needed to come out, that emotion. do you notice that a lot, that rage and anger is hidden?

It’s very difficult to… there’s a lot of shame on anger and guilt. Yeah, that emotion groove. So, but anger… and now I call it, instead of anger, our inner fire. Because it’s about limits, it’s about…

Yeah

Speaker 1 (36:47.758)
Speaker 2 (36:56.15)
Everything is It’s like there’s no way to take a move with this. We need it. We need it to be real. We need it to walk in our boots. Because if you suppress it, then there’s a lot of fakeness as well.

Yeah

Speaker 1 (37:12.59)
It’s like standing, I just see standing in your power, boundary settings, saying no. That’s not okay that that was happened, that happened to me. That’s a no from me. You need that to take care of yourself. It’s not just we feel the rage and healing and then we never feel angry again. It helps you to feel angry.

So we need to

Speaker 2 (37:30.972)
f***ing hell.

It’s a warrior. No, the light and dark.

Yes, and for me, anger and eating disorder helped me recover because I was so angry, could have had a bit more compassion to myself thinking back, but this worked for me. I was so angry at the part of me that was afraid of fucking food. I was like, this is ridiculous, I’m a grown-ass woman, I’m afraid of food. I am so angry at the fact that I just can’t eat food and just feel normal. So that anger like drove like…

the recovery because I was just so angry that I just couldn’t be free. So it actually really helped me.

I think the upper layer from the eating disorder, with you and the podcast people who are listening, is the eating disorder for other ones. Is it like a drugs addiction or…

Speaker 1 (38:28.15)
It’s just something else. Do you know Gabor Mate? I love him. He says, doesn’t he, it’s not why the addiction, it’s why pain.

No, we need to go to those deeper layers. Yeah, there is the solution.

Speaker 1 (38:47.489)
I digress. So the second weekend

It’s outside movement. Yeah, and there’s a lot of shame as well in movements to be your outside big self.

without being holding back and what does she think of me, what does he think

Yeah, because you have movement from strength, know doing the squats, doing the lunge. Authentic movement.

Is that what they call it? static dancing?

Speaker 2 (39:17.742)
I think no, I think this is not deeper, I think the movement is deeper because aesthetic dancing is also a whole community again.

Yeah, and it’s set up with a certain sound and… Yeah.

Yes, I did this as well. what you see in aesthetic dance scene is still people are looking for each other, each other, each other, each other to fill them up. know, it’s a little bit spiritual.

Maybe you get a spiritual light from kind of spiritual friend.

Yeah.

Speaker 2 (39:53.166)
Outside of movement is none of them.

So what could it look like a tiger crawling because it could it look like Someone going crazy like can it look like all different things like primal stuff

When someone is surrendered through all those emotions, then sometimes it looks like rough, know, rough.

Yeah. Like… …sorts of things.

Yes, everything. And I will go help with different movements and stuff like that so they can just feel by themselves.

Speaker 1 (40:28.83)
Yeah, that’s really powerful because if they’ve allowed themselves to be witnessed also in yeah It’s like part part of my fear of giving birth was being witnessed. I wasn’t afraid of the birth itself I was afraid of being witnessed by others in my most intimate primal Moments because I didn’t feel safe to be witnessed at my most vulnerable, you

because there’s no relate, there’s no math. It’s just like complete primal.

This is who I am right now.

Yeah and that’s beautiful right because there are no masks and then this is where the training is all about put your masks down.

Yeah, I love that. Yeah. Until next weekend.

Speaker 2 (41:08.814)
And then we have the plant medicine trip. No Ayahuasca but Choco Bliss. Ayahuasca is very hard, this is like a little bit more gentle. And chocolate. chocolate! So you go through your ego and then through your fruit.

more gentle. Is it a drink?

Speaker 2 (41:38.808)
Bye.

And then I guess everyone has a different experience. Do they go inwards? Is it mainly a closed-eye experience? And then guess you set intentions and the safety.

Yeah, do a ceremony around it and I make it safe and beautiful.

Yeah, for us, yeah. Wow. And then that’s the third weekend, how many were they?

Just one day, one day we have and then the integration will start and they are a little community because we have like the… So yeah, then we talk a little bit when there are questions and then we have the coming back…

Speaker 1 (42:08.608)
Yeah

Speaker 1 (42:17.23)
How long apart is that from the inner child stuff?

Well, I’m doing now the pilot groups. So I’m thinking now about the best time is like max two months or something in between. Yeah.

in between so the people come for these three weekends and then after that do they have that coaching with you in between?

Speaker 1 (42:48.974)
Yeah, I guess stuff does come up. Integration can take time. can be surprising or it can just be a beautiful unfolding. I guess it can be different for everybody. Wow, that’s so powerful.

except you

Speaker 2 (43:02.83)
I can see already very beautiful things in the pilot groups and maybe it is a good idea as well to some one week know one week retreat

Yeah, a whole retreat, like a whole experience, almost like a holiday, vacation in combined. So if people are listening and they’re not in Holland or they’re in America and they’re not in Europe and they’re not easily accessible to hear, I know there’s nothing like in person. Do you do something online? Because obviously I don’t, well I do in person if someone wants to come here, you’re welcome. All my stuff’s online and they get incredible.

results. Obviously you go a lot deeper with the plant medicine and everything. what do you do online if someone wants to do

I have the online environment also an English book for your inner child and the one on coaching online so we can do it online right

nice.

Speaker 1 (44:00.974)
Yeah, when they have you like one-on-one so you’re like fully fully theirs Yes. and would someone be able to let’s say I was a new client of yours and you followed the kind of the same structure so that sounds like a beautiful structure if I had the wanted experience of the plant medicine I guess it would be I would source that myself if whatever country I was in even though it’s legal but who cares about

Yeah, I get that. It’s also possible.

Speaker 1 (44:26.41)
Yeah, it’s legal over here. And then you would guide me like online through that experience as long as I was safe and you would, could you do that whole experience?

No, no, no, no, if you only want to plant medicine then it’s possible but then I do it also in multiple days. Okay. Yeah, so not one day. also a four before one day the plant medicine trip and then maybe two or three days. No, no. for the safety because I really want to

But that could all be online.

Exactly. You need to be there. You can’t be there. But everything else you can do online.

Yeah, and I am also a speaker as well. So that’s also, yeah, in other countries is also possible.

Speaker 1 (45:18.702)
all over the world. So I want to go to, let me just think of something tangible. So let’s say someone’s an eating disorder recovery, which is just recovery because that’s just a symptom. Say someone’s discovered that eating disorder was a coping mechanism because they don’t feel good enough and they need to be perfect and all the things. How would they start working with their inner child? Like if someone’s like, okay, how do I actually work with my inner child and what does that mean? Can you give us like a tangible example?

Yeah, well, I’m also asked to treat the three, the method of the three steps. The knowledge and evidence-based. And then we go to the personal leadership and then we go through the body. But first we go like from the outside, you know, from the ego, ego mechanism, we just take steps to the

I sense a root. Yeah.

to remove the alcoholics.

Yeah, yeah, the root.

Speaker 2 (46:24.17)
Yeah, so we take the copy mechanism of course as a for the

start a starter yeah yeah go and what does it look like does it look like speaking to you in a child connecting with her or him and reparenting that child like I know there’s different ways yeah what’s one of your favorite ways

I do a lot of for the Theta Meditations. So that’s the level where everything can be changed for reprogramming.

Speaker 2 (47:05.07)
I will set you

in a different state.

with parents also because

With your inner parent you mean?

No, exactly. But what you see also with this is the problem started in the beginning. So in the meditation you will invite as well the parents. So we go deep in this.

Speaker 1 (47:34.552)
Yes, yes, yes. Yeah, so I did that. my coach asked me when I was on the mushrooms to allow my mom to come in the room. And it was crazy how vivid and what her body language was and what she was doing and how I felt. And I had my inner child with me and she said to me, go and tell your inner child she’s okay to play. And my child was like…

exit

Speaker 1 (48:00.054)
It’s not okay, I need to make sure my mum’s okay. I can’t play, I need to make sure my mum’s okay. And I just, my god, the dynamic of that was just insane. And my mum was just sat there with, sitting on her hands, like, look, basically like it being like a child, just not saying anything.

Yeah, nervous system remembers everything.

It’s amazing that in the right environment, so you guide them through all sorts of, depending on the person, what they need.

doing like creative stuff, constellations, you know?

Yeah, there’s a lot of things I’ll do.

Speaker 1 (48:37.388)
and everyone’s different depending on what they use at what time.

Speaker 1 (48:44.526)
It’s personal to the person and there’s no like, right in your childhood you do this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, in this order and then you’re all good.

No, I really… Intune, yeah. Exactly, and what do you need? What will help you?

In. In. In. In. In. In.

Speaker 1 (49:03.982)
What do we do? Yes, in each moment. I guess, what was the last homework you gave a client for inner child’s work? I know everyone’s doing it. I guess it needs to continue when they’re not with you in session.

Beautiful question.

Speaker 2 (49:19.022)
there was one lady and she didn’t cry for 10 years. And then she did the training, we did a week at one and she was like open up. So there were a lot of inner crying, crying, crying. But for her sister, it was very

See

Speaker 1 (49:25.614)
10 years.

Speaker 1 (49:37.742)
the child’s

Speaker 1 (49:41.77)
And so she still didn’t actually physically cry.

Yes, after 10 years!

I bet she felt so much relief.

In this weekend yes, and a couple of days after yes, but today I’ve heard her on the phone as she’s singing. So I feel a lot of

She’s seven minutes-

Speaker 1 (50:03.714)
That means energy. Yeah. Yeah.

the same feeling I felt. So I did say to her, just sit on the bed, sit on the couch, every day for five minutes, that’s it. Yeah, just in silence, close your eyes or look outside, no wrestles, no goal, just do this, yeah? That’s it. And I see this group this weekend.

Just inside.

Speaker 1 (50:36.59)
And we know something’s gonna shift if she doesn’t. Because that restlessness, I know it so well, I’ve done so much healing but I was telling Salomon only today, yesterday, that switch flicked and I was like, looking at the house, everything is cleaning, Lucy’s… So it’s recognisable now but that anxious energy needs to go somewhere. Whereas if we just sit with it, which is what we don’t want to do…

Yeah.

Did she really just give me fucking five minutes to sit every day? Well that’s the work, right? What we don’t want to do.

because her system was already like closing, closing, because it was unsafe, unsafe, unsafe and she was like avoiding with stuff doing, you know? Just this exercise, that’s it, I see you in the big hands.

I love the simplicity of that because there’s that old story I’ve heard in a book somewhere that a guy who’s very unhappy, very unwell, very stressed goes to the doctor, doesn’t know why it would be a doctor, I’m not stating doctor at the same time I can’t amount, goes to a doctor anyway and says, I have all these things wrong with me and the doctor says, go and meditate for 10 minutes every day. I’ve not got time for that, okay, so you now need to meditate for an hour every day.

Speaker 2 (51:49.358)
I you.

was just a story. That was just a story. But that’s kind of ironic because what we say we haven’t got time for, need the most. Where we don’t want to go in terms of the emotions we don’t want to feel, we need to feel because that’s exactly the treasure. At the end of everything we want is at the end of the path we least want to walk. But we have to be ready though. like you were sharing with me when we were eating, it’s layer by layer. It’s not just…

You can’t force healing, just happens. You create space for it, you do the work, and then it will unfold. You have to allow it.

If you are a coach, then you need to be aware of this. It is not like pushing. We need to take a look at ourselves at all times. Otherwise you can project everything on those clients. It is like a normal tempo, organic.

for sure.

Speaker 1 (52:50.97)
It doesn’t matter if some people take longer than others. It just matters that they want to heal and they’re doing their work to heal. If nothing changes, nothing changes. You can’t just want it and then sit there and be like, I don’t want to be uncomfortable or afraid, so I’m just going to wait. Something needs to change. But you can take it, steady.

Yeah.

Speaker 1 (53:14.26)
I’ve noticed the more layers you peel back, then it’s kind of easier. The next one’s a little bit easier, even if it’s like even deeper. Yeah. It’s an experience that you can handle. Yeah.

Yeah, and you need to be present, that’s it. Present. That’s so nice.

It sounds simple and the ego is like, that’s ridiculous, it needs to be way more complicated than that.

It’s not complicated. And this lady is all, I think she, I’m the coach for her right now, almost two years. This weekend just, she cried, you know, so it’s a very long time when she felt safe to

in.

Speaker 1 (53:53.614)
That’s again, you having that safe relationship with her, she couldn’t get to this point by herself. She needs to heal in relationship to others and you’re this other person, this safe space that she gets to, you you are the mirror and the support and she gets to heal from that. We have to do it with somebody, even if it’s a partner that has nothing to do with…

Being a coach, you need someone that you love and trust to mirror back to you who you are and who you’re not and who you’re being and who you’re not to choose something different for yourself.

Precisely it is. Precisely. Precisely. Exactly. that’s English.

It would be so hard to not only be interviewed but also be like, yeah, I need to also put it into a different language. So it’s incredible. And I think one last, yeah, he’s let the dog out to give us a warning of the dog. So is there anything that I’ve not asked you that you would like to share with our listeners?

sorry.

Speaker 2 (54:48.75)
Really?

Speaker 2 (54:56.928)
Wow, but you have asked me such beautiful questions. Yeah. Really? Yeah. No, I think this was very good. my path is like, you ask about my path.

Thank you for

Speaker 1 (55:08.558)
Yeah

Speaker 1 (55:15.054)
complete with her. Last question, what would you say to the younger you who felt so overwhelmed and confused and sad and broken? You’re not broken, but maybe she felt broken. Yeah, sometimes.

going something big, you a live event and she still feels broken sometimes, know, very. But I will tell her that I’m so proud of her. Hell yeah! Hell yes, mom, mom, wow, she’s going through everything, you know, even it’s so painful.

Yeah. Badass. I just want to feel emotional now because I can just… There’s just a presence about you, this like wise, centered, grounded like power and hopefully you can feel it through the lens. But I just want to acknowledge the woman you are. I’ve only just got to know you but you can just see it and feel it so thank you for doing your healing.

She’s here.

Speaker 1 (56:22.894)
It’s everything you can’t do this on a podcast. So thank you everybody for tuning in. Showing my boobs and all sorts of things.

Yeah. Yeah, me.

Speaker 2 (56:34.387)
I go away with some tears.

Yeah, we do. It wouldn’t be a proper podcast, right? But thank you, Sana, for your time. And I’ll obviously pop all your details so people can reach out to you if they want to be in your way. And if this would be a good recording, that would be awesome. If not, then it is what it is. See you next time.

You